aorin: (pic#)
[personal profile] aorin
Hehe... I was aiming to post up the first entry to my LJ on my birthday. But many things - an outing with friends, dinner party, cake blowing and a traffic jam - was in my way in completing this task. I just hope I managed to make it in time to finish this post before the clock inevitably strikes 12.

Oh, my birthday presents this year are... a few text messages and a bill for dinner which my friend footed on my behalf  ::sighs:: Seems like presents these day are rather immaterial? Also, I've received a truly memorable present from my younger sister.

Basch/Ashe

Well, she did say that money doesn't matter and it was the heart that counts.

Btw, do you know that chinese folks - especially those in my country - tend to celebrate their birthday twice. Once according to the Chinese Lunar calendar, while the other according to the normal calendar. Not that I receive double the presents, but I did get two cakes XD

(no subject)

Date: 2007-09-08 05:44 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] valeria-15.livejournal.com
well, hehe, I am one of those that fell into that -balthier- trap. XD (raises hand) then, because I can't get enough of playing FFXII, and to convince myself that I'd search for better weapons next time, I found myself falling head over heels with Basch - completely. (in that game-fandom-fantasy sort of way)

And I'd like to say that the rest of your analysis of Basch/Ashe was simply fantastic. I know it's more or less, agreeing with me, but your topping it off was perfect. =)

As for playing the characters, I tend to have Vaan with Penelo all the time. I guess it is because they work so good together - their spunk and energy combined.

And with Fran, I'll have her switch to be with either party. Fran as a character to begin with annoyed me at first because of her 'oh the mist, the mist' but then she grew on me. And my first fanfic in FFXII was Fran's pov, 3rd. I normally use Basch,Balthier, Vaan as the "tanks"; however, on Fran, because I have her switch to and fro - she doesn't strike me to be proficient in one area.

All this discussion about the characters, well, no matter what, I really love them all. I know we have our personal favourites, and really, i try not to make it so obvious. ^^ But, even so, I could dislike writing about a certain couple at this point of time, but later, i find myself curious and wanting to try out different avenues.

though, like I mentioned to you last week, there's that bit of bias seeping in me towards the ashe/basch dynamics. =)


(no subject)

Date: 2007-09-14 10:01 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] aorin107.livejournal.com
Balthier amuses me sometimes, he does have a few catchy lines that made me laugh, and we can see he has a good heart, but it is his 'leading man' attitude that made me roll my eyes, and men that are attention-seeking, and acts like a ladies man just ends up the wrong side of me, I didn't buy his act. Al-Cid, surprisingly, didn't annoy me as much because he is outright attention-seeking, and doesn't deny it.

I wasn't fond of Basch's general look before the release, just seem like another muscular bloke to me. In fact, I didn't think any of the characters looks particularly appealing (comparison to Cloud and Squall, mainly). Basch grew on me as time passed, his story with Noah was one of the things that kept me continuing the game.

On the contrary, I kept Basch because he's my meat shield, Ashe for magick and cure, while Vaan for speed and ease of control. I level my characters according to this manner, Basch -> Vaan -> Ashe -> Fran -> Balthier -> Penelo, alternating switching them one after another. It wasn't so much of favouritism over the character, but rather which team I find it easier to maintain and control. Penelo was placed last because she was the final character to join the party, and couldn't measure up to my other characters.

While I enjoy majority of the characters, I still have my favourites. Somehow, I'd wish I was less bias at times and accept them equally, in hopes that it wouldn't cloud my judgment. In my current state of mind, I doubt that would happen, but I might grow out of it eventually. For instance, I didn't hate Penelo but I didn't care much about her either, but things change along the way.

(no subject)

Date: 2007-09-16 12:48 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] valeria-15.livejournal.com
hehe, I was immediately fond of Basch when he appeared before Rasler, and when he did that first Quickening I was smirking. Don't Dalmascan Knights get laid? Because they should. (blush)

I've been re-reading some French Aristocrats/females who have contributed a lot of the "courtly love" theme. And ironically, since SE developed Ashelia's features to resemble close to having French leaning/ancestry, I can't imagine that this isn't some kind of coincidence. Frankly speaking, it's also where the Dalmascan Knights were formed.

I've been reading historical pieces to get my juices flowing on the subject, and to be inspired by the romantic background of its origin.

A Knight, chivalrous as the word implies, is a valiant soldier who is in love with the Queen. Loosely speaking, but as much as he is in love with the Queen, he is in love with what the Queen represents: the country in which he serves.

It is an impossible love, because the Queen normally belongs to the Lord he serves. And he therefore fights in honour of her attention. Very romantic based, and in a sad way, it's unfulfilled passionately. Because their path is pure, almost virginal.

But this isn't to mean that it's a path that demands chastity - the honour bound Knight is fighting for something higher than his own life, almost egotistic in a pure sense.

It's more or less a path that demands a single-minded loyalty and devotion, to one country: one woman.

wellll, sorry for that, I was just slightly inspired. I need to, to be so involved in this pair. ;)

(no subject)

Date: 2007-09-16 01:22 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] valeria-15.livejournal.com
Retyping, because I so win. XD

Earlier, I meant to add * Dalmascan Knights were formed - Under Ashelia's kingdom. ;)

So, erm, the men in the Dalmascan line must have had their queens chosen then?

Ok, well, as I tried to explain earlier, mess it up, and pardon moi for the err. The Queen for example, has the title of both King and Queen, she is the 'king' of her country, so she doesn't have the power to pronounce her would be husband to be "king," therefore, he would be titled, "Prince."

As for a King, what I meant to say, is that he has the power to pronounce his would be bride "Queen," even if she is not of noble birth. Since he has the authority, the woman, like the Guinevere in Arthur is called a Queen.

But in cases, like Ashelia's situation: She cannot name her husband King. I know it sounds a bit strange, but that's how it is.

(no subject)

Date: 2007-09-30 04:44 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] aorin107.livejournal.com
Basch in the opening cinematics was absolutely delicious looking. The black armour and how he handle himself in war makes him the epitome of a dashing knight. Rasler, if I may say, pale in comparison, and seemed so childish. I wonder if it would be a crime for Ashe to pay attention to that handsome captain instead of her own husband ^^;;

To me, it would be an insult to women if those man-candy Dalmascan knights weren't laid once or twice or thrice, if I had my way. They are knights, not monks, it's not like they have to practice celibacy, right? I swear if these manly looking knights didn't have a fanclub or two in Rabanastre, then it may have been a proper course of action if Vayne had demolished Dalmasca for good cause those blind girls doesn't deserve to live XD

OH~~ Looks like someone have been really hardworking recently. But yes, what you've said summed up the workings of the 'Courtly Love' theme practiced by knights in history.

For my case, I'm not very well-versed in the medieval period, but when I plotted out 'Courtly Love', I did some reading and research of my own. It's been so long ago, but if there's one point that stood out to me is that this theme is the prescribed the courtly ettiquette between knights and the ladies, where the ladies often inspires the knight to perform great feats and deeds. While, he does it because he craves her attention and to win her favour, even if he knows that their relationship wouldn't be consummated and remain ideal.

Basically, I would think that is what Basch practices in the game itself, but only on the surface. Somehow, there seemed to be more emotional investment for him, when it comes to Ashe, and he sees her more than just a symbol that represents the country that he loves.

Though, personally, I had another reason for choosing this as the title for the story. First of all, majority of the story takes place in the past within the Dalmasca royal courts, and it deals with how Basch and Ashe behave to each other and the development of their relationship. While it is not neccesarily loyal to the definition of 'Courtly Love' but there are some references to the idea.

Secondly, even if I haven't written this part yet, another huge theme for the story revolves around tournaments. Historically, there's where the knights uses the opportunity to fight for his lady's honour, to gain themselves favour by showing their prowess, also job prospects and a form of competition. But, in Basch's case, he does it to honour Ashe and to show his affection, one of the only few ways he knows how. Come to think about it, even if the main focus of the story is from Ashe's POV, but ultimately it was Basch's actions that is more loyal to the title itself. O_o Strange?

Even more stange regarding the fact that the Queen regnant can't name her consort as the King, while the King regnant can pronounce his consort as Queen. Sexist in nature or just to avoid confusion? I suppose Ashe is the first Dalmascan queen in story, but this probably applies to her as well. But I was confuse with the differences between King-consort and Prince-consort. Is this just a matter of styling the title to their preferences or it would deviate for different individuals. For instance, if Ashe chooses Basch, who is a commoner, would he be styled prince-consort or king-consort? Or if she chooses Al-Cid, who is a high-born of Rozarria, would he be indusputably named King-consort?

(no subject)

Date: 2007-10-07 04:38 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] valeria-15.livejournal.com
re-posted because the other post was not formatted correctly.:(

I have to agree with you about Rasler. I saw that many fangirls thought he was pretty. He’s alright, but too childish looking, although – I must admit when he spoke, it was beautiful: masculine enough but not too harsh. The voice of a man/boy whatever, really makes the character. Can you imagine placing a high pitched girly voice into Basch? Absolutely stomach churning and laughable. And although I’ve decidedly fallen in love with Balthier before I even played the games, he’s not exactly very interesting to me these days.

You know, Basch would by his lady’s side if he hadn’t given a promise to his brother. Naturally, it is also for the Empire, because it being such a large chunk of Ivalice, politics there effects those of neighbouring countries. And seriously, how long does Larsa need protection? Not much longer if he decides to find another protector or when he reaches of age, and when he marries. I don’t rightly know how Lord Gramis had chosen his wife, because she’s not in the picture at all, or even mentioned. It’s always about the boys of the family, or the men in the Solidor line.


I think that, with Lady Ashe, she’s the last of her kind, and fics that will have her marry, would probably have her either with Al-Cid, or maybe Larsa when he’s older. If in all seriousness, she is supposed to marry Larsa for the sake of leaving a legacy to pass on, it’d be almost like the Anakin Skywalker and Padme wedding (they being age wise apart); but Anakin was a trained Jedi – not a ruler of a country.

Isn’t it interesting how the creators perhaps subconsciously placed Lady Ashe as the female who can either be distinguished with many aspects of being paired with all the male characters. In some form or another?

The only thing that really surprised me with FFXII, was the ending where Penelo mentions Ashe misses Basch. That was a huge surprise. Because, all through the game, you don’t get a sense of pairing with anyone. And I heard that its been mentioned perhaps by square enix that the romance would be complicated. If so, how complicated can it be? And the only indication that would lead to a supposed pairing is the mention of Ashe only missing Basch. There’s no mention of her missing anyone else. She’s spent all that time with all of them on their journey, yet, her longing was to have the Knight by her. Yes, the length of time was a year, and I’m assuming that Penelo, Vaan, and even Basch had been able to visit through out that year.


As for the sky pirates: Fran and Balthier, it took them an entire year to actually show up. I wonder what the hell were they doing? :D As for Queen Ashe, if she chooses a commoner to marry, and though, he possesses a title – properly respected and considered a ‘sir’, for a Knight, he would still have the title, Prince. As for Al-Cid, he’s royalty, but he’s not a Prince, or a King in his country. The thing with Larsa, he’s an Emperor, and that title would bring Ashe “Empress.”

(no subject)

Date: 2007-09-14 10:17 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] aorin107.livejournal.com
I'll be only too glad to spoil you rotten about the Basch/Ashe moments, or at least, my intepretations of those scenes. I honestly saw an abundance of little hints towards this pairing, and there was quite a strong reference that supports them. Nothing explicit that makes you think that they've hooked up but you definitely get the vibe SE was trying to hint something about them. Simultaneously, they showed some interaction between Ashe and Balthier T_T. But overall, I find the interaction between Ashe/Basch and Balthier/Fran to be more weighty in comparison to others.

There are a few scenes which indicate that Ashe cares about her ex-retainer more than a liege should, and while it is not explicitly romantic, it definitely was better than what the original game has to offer:

1) Basch and Ashe joins your party during Chapter 8 when you return to Ivalice from Lemures. In this FMV, Ashe smiled at Basch who smiled back at her. Apparently, Basch had joined Ashe on the Leviathan (which was the Ashe's queen brigade), and together they both greet Vaan and party. Also, later, Basch told the party that someone was waiting for them at the Dalmasca Westersand. The party arrived to find Larsa there, it seems that Basch and Larsa both arrived in Dalmasca but Larsa decided to remain on land, while Basch and Ashe went on to retrieve your party. Is it me, or is there some matchmaking by the little emperor again?

2) There was a river bay scene, they were talking about politics and after a while, Ashe said that Basch didn't change and ask what he thinks about the current her. To which, Basch replied that she's a responsible person and that her wishes and the people's wishes are same. She then turn around and thank him for his honest answer.

3) There's a scene where Basch takes on the Judge of Wings head on alone, and Ashe shouted his name in anxiety. She screamed Basch immediately when she saw him in danger, and after some exchange of sword blows, the entire party would gather and the battle ensues.

4) Once, Ashe saw a massacre of Aegyls and she went weak on the knees. Basch moved forth to catch her, held her and told her that if she falters and avert her eyes now, she'll only find darkness ahead. She nod, stood up and turn to face the challenges before her.

5) Before the final boss battle, Vaan kneeled down before Ashe solemnly and swore that he'll do his best to protect the Queen. Basch raised his sword, and told Ashe to be careful as this well-behaved and chivalrous Vaan might be an impostor. Ashe jokingly told Basch that he should be the last person to make such a comment (probably refering to the earlier fiasco and him impersonating his bro). Vaan then stood up, and said that it's a good thing that Ashe laughs as frowning all the time would only increase wrinkles. Ashe sounded mildly insulted, and Basch laughed as well. I love this scene, because it shows the familiarity between them, and how comfortable Ashe is with Basch. She laughed at his lame attempt at jokes, and that shows that Basch could unwittingly make her happy.

6) The ending, after the final battle, Ashe turns around and smiles at Basch (note the expression on my icon), then Balthier and Fran went to the cockpit to fly the Strahl. Ashe remained on the deck, standing near to Basch.

7) Credits, there were images similar to the credits of FFXII, but it shows the aftermath of FFXII: RW. Ashe was gazing sadly at the sky, while Basch was behind her walking towards Larsa with a smile on his face, and Larsa seemed really happy, only Ashe seemed unhappy .While some interpret that she was still pining for Balthier or thinking about her past, I disagree with it. Throughout the game, she gave advice to the other characters to let go of their past and look to the future, as for Balthier, the ending showed him with Fran, and that he finally came in terms with his past (he was visiting his father's grave). Besides, they practically made Bal/Fran canon with all the interactions between them. I presume, Ashe's sadness was due to loneliness and that Basch wouldn't remained by her side.

Therefore, sum up, even if SE didn't officialize this pairing, they stop short of confirming this pairing, but I would say that they made it quite clear how close their relationship were :)

(no subject)

Date: 2007-09-16 12:29 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] valeria-15.livejournal.com
I am floored with this. (the revenant wings update ) Thank you! It left me squealing a bit. Of course, there's that logical side to me that says, well, it's only because of this....or that, leaving me with no option of ever becoming fully attached to the idea of their close to canon coupling.

It's interesting how Ashe asks Basch for his opinion. OH god, how she has come to honour his thoughts more so than most people. Asking him about how she is in his eyes.

I want to knock Basch over the head fondly myself. XD He should have gone up to her, held her hand and said, "Your Majesty, if I may..." And gives her that look that he can attempt sexily if he wished it. haha.

Ashe is definitely lonely. Poor woman. She has a lot of responsibilities and so does Basch. The two are so fulfilled in their roles, that their distance just makes it all the more unbearable. Gasp. That was the silent shipper in me ;)

I've noticed this a lot with classical romance in the Japanese sense. Or maybe it's just the background romances of main character's whose parents are always apart. Not apart in which they're divorced or anything like that, but in which they are distanced because they have other responsibilities to attend to. And their coming together is so bittersweet. Sometimes, comical because of the tension.

(no subject)

Date: 2007-09-30 03:18 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] aorin107.livejournal.com
Ehee... that comes to show that you are thinking rationally instead of shipping. But FFXII is all about subtlety, vagueness and free interpretation, and I should probably stick to my own view, since everyone else is doing the same. I doubt this couple would ever be consider canon coupling, quite an impossible task, and one that requires lots of proper story-telling to make it functional.

Haha, I'm so glad that was the one scene that stood out among all. About that scene, Ashe's line to Basch: You didn’t change. What do you think about… the present me? appear in RW: Trailer 7 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fyJ50RzVBmg), a while back. I wrote a translation for it, and posted it everywhere with the propaganda of influencing people...! Eck! But I swear I was very loyal to the original text, and literally translated it word by word. Take an example:

My translation - Ashe: If you’re going to mess up this country... I will protect it.
SE translation - Ashe: If you will bring turmoil to my kingdom... I will defend it.

Well, at least I've gotten the basic structure right ^^;;

How I wished that had actually happened, cause that will totally knock Ashe off her shoes? XD When I first saw that line in the trailer, I had a discussion with some people and we agree that if it were some other pairing, it would have been personal and hinting towards a romantic notion. But since, it is Basch and Ashe, most likely it would turn out to be some political discussion. We even concluded that even if Ashe were suggesting it as a personal question, Basch would probably give her an unromantic answer and start preaching about duties and responsibilities.

In the end, we decided anything would be fine, as long as Basch didn’t went up to her suddenly, held both her hands and said, “Your majesty, if I may be allowed to speak my heart freely. I… think you’ve gained weight.” Then Ashe would surely push him into the river, armour and all.

But yes, it is interesting how much she weights his opinion compared to other, almost like she wants to make him proud of her. And it is simply adorable that she chose to share her fears with him, a man that she held in contempt for so long, but now, values his opinions more than anyone else. It’s quite sad that even if she has everything she fought for during the game and with Dalmasca prospering, she’s still lonely. Why I wonder? I’m sure she’ll find company easily if she wants to, Vaan and Pen is still there, but Pen did say that Ashe drifted away from them instead of the other way around due to duties.

In the epilogue, I find it sweet that she obviously misses him, but for appearance’s sake, she keeps herself away from him. Like she’s almost shy to let him know her feelings, because she doesn’t want to burden him or she thought he left her for Archadia.

I trust this to be a cultural and social norm for Asian. I come from a chinese family, and there's something like a hierachy system in the family, with each of us assigned to different roles and responsiblities, and we are expected to perform to it. It’s hard to explain, but even as a family, we are expected to understand why each of us play our parts, and no questions asked. Our relationship can be seen as distant and uncaring, but notably, there's also some deep understanding that binds the family together.
Page generated Jul. 20th, 2025 05:37 pm
Powered by Dreamwidth Studios